Crash.Net User: TalentFan

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TalentFan

June 25, 2014 1:38 PM

MotoGP » Guy Coulon (Tech 3) - Q&A


Brain: I dont care what method of induction you use, when you try to lay 250 hp to the ground on a strip of rubber the width of a band aid, its going to try and and break loose, then you will be searching for electronics to control wheel spin.
See? You look at fixing a problem from the wrong end? Does it need spelling out? A pure engineering solution is that you don't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut - you use just the right amount of force needed. So if 250hp cannot be managed by human reflexes alone.... THEN 250HP IS AN UNNECESSARY AND POINTLESS AMOUNT! If your thought process was followed to a logical conclusion then why not fully automate and remove the pilot altogether? They could certainly make an unencumbered machine ultimately faster.

TalentFan

June 25, 2014 12:52 PM

MotoGP » Marquez: It can’t go on forever!


.......... when he cannot get the feedback he would find essential if he had to ride the limits on his own skills. The electronics are WHY the bikes can be built to maximise performance without the need for the engineers to concern themselves with usability - because thy know they can use the electronics to retain control! It's an overcomplicated way to push the limits by bypassing rider skls and the feedback info they need to use skill. Mfrs don't want simpler better methods as it reduces their advantage.

TalentFan

June 24, 2014 2:45 PM
Last Edited 29 days ago

MotoGP » Marquez: It can’t go on forever!


@ Brain Your argument that Motogp is for technology innovation is badly flawed btw. It's a control series, just the limits and constraints are badly biased toward those with most of the advantages already. A MotoGP bike uses the basic piston engine that's been around over a century. It's got optimised with exotic materials and electronics but it's still just a piston engine. Same goes for the chassis and telescopic forks etc. Factories drove for engine limits and fuel limits as these constraints mean you need massive budgets and resources with electronics and data management to maximise an artificial scenario - giving them a huge edge. You are recycling age old factory media spin arguments to try to justify the ridiculous rules and situation******************************************************** EDIT by CRASH.NET: Removed poster attack. Please refrain from attacking other posters.

TalentFan

June 25, 2014 1:31 PM

MotoGP » Guy Coulon (Tech 3) - Q&A


So 'Brain' and others.... I think Guy Coulon is terrific. And I can certainly respect his opinion. But yes, he does have to consider which side his bread is buttered before he opens his mouth. He is a very smart man - far too smart to put his foot on his mouth and bite the hand that feeds. Also of course points made are valid - no one had gone to absolute extreme of saying the bikes require NO rider skill and heaps of bravery. But... Apart from the obvious that Factory's introduced electronic aids as they bypass the natural human processing and reflex constraints to gain advantage, there is the proof that they provide advantage anyway.... Simply because they would not be employed if they did not. Plain logic. You ought to try using some.

TalentFan

June 25, 2014 1:24 PM

MotoGP » Guy Coulon (Tech 3) - Q&A


.......... Basically the real reason for rider aids is unfair advantage. Before you accept tripe that they don't have significant impact.... Ask yourself why Factories spent a fortune on electronics if they don't provide advantage? Sometimes I feel I live in a world where Stupid is a pandemic. The electronics are WHY the bikes can be built to maximise performance without the need for the engineers to concern themselves with usability - because thy know they can use the electronics to retain control! It's an overcomplicated way to push the limits by bypassing rider skls and the feedback info they need to use skill. Mfrs don't want simpler better and much cheaper things like building bikes that have to factor in rider needs and human limitations - simply as it reduces their advantage.

TalentFan

June 25, 2014 1:19 PM

MotoGP » Guy Coulon (Tech 3) - Q&A


Ok then. gaps between the front runners is smaller with the electronics. It's a logical conclusion. The rider aids minimise and also correct small errors so less time can be lost - the potential of the package is maximised. But... It's creating the illusion of greater competition while in actuality removing competition. Even among the front 4. With no rider aids the gaps may be bigger but the relative rider performances would be more REAL. Also the potential for error when pushing means far greater opportunity for the other competing rider who didn't overdo it or make a mistake. They used to call such a scenario Racing - you may have heard of it. The bikes and tyres now are set up (as CE inferred) to maximise ultimate performance but without needing to worry about manageability and feel for the pilot. Because they use electronics to cut in when the brave pilot puts faith on the systems and pins it when he cannot get the feedback he would find essential to determine what action to take.

TalentFan

June 25, 2014 12:50 PM

MotoGP » Marquez: It can’t go on forever!


@ Brain I had worked out myself that the gaps between the front runners is smaller with the electronics. It's a logical conclusion. The rider aids minimise and also correct small errors so less time can be lost - the potential of the package is maximised. But... It's creating the illusion of greater competition while in actuality removing competition. Even among the front 4. With no rider aids the gaps may be bigger but the relative rider performances would be more REAL. Also the potential for error when pushing means far greater opportunity for the other competing rider who didn't overdo it or make a mistake. They used to call such a scenario Racing - you may have heard of it. The bikes and tyres now are set up (as CE inferred) to maximise ultimate performance but without needing to worry about manageability and feel for the pilot. Because they use electronics to cut in when the brave pilot puts faith on the systems and pins it when he cannot get the feedback he would find ess

TalentFan

June 24, 2014 11:49 AM

MotoGP » Colin Edwards: 'Faith and feel'


I'd love it if somehow Colin felt free to be totally open about what really goes on in MotoGP once he hangs up his helmet. I have a feeling though that confidentiality contracts and the risk of getting sued may gag even Colin. Pity. I feel pretty sure that Colin could provide inside info that would burst an awful lot of Crash poster bubbles about just what does what and what it all really means for a riders chances in MotoGP over the last few years.

TalentFan

June 24, 2014 2:34 PM

MotoGP » Marquez: It can’t go on forever!


@ mustafur I'd settle for a ban on rider aids and TC, with no carbon discs and a sensible rev limit. The above would mean teams don't need hugely expensive data systems, not pneumatic valves and exotic materials. The power would have a natural cap as teams stopped striving for absolute power and focused on useable power and power delivery for the riders. Best of all riders would have only their own skills and inputs to pilot the bike. To sum up we would still need teams to do the best job of setting up and maximising their bikes (just chasing new goals) and a genuine sporting contest for teams and riders, with the bonus of affordable budgets and strong depth of competition through the grid. Then if Marquez still blew all rivals away I could applaud his achievement genuinely. It's simple and effective. So Factory teams will fight like blazes to block such common sense, as it stops them tilting the field grossly in their favour.

TalentFan

June 24, 2014 9:30 AM

MotoGP » Marquez: It can’t go on forever!


Insidejob: "You really, REALLY dont live up to your really, REALLY unfortunate username do you." Ha ha Talentfan. Neither do you. Will you be watching the races?
How would you know? It's getting too hard to determine talent levels when there's so much electronic intervention clouding the issue. Do you know where a MM or a JL input gets modulated by the tech? No if course you don't. So many blindly assume it's all the pilot and then post bugging up the performance as though it's a fact that it's all the pilot. All the aids would not be there if they could not and do not do the job better and instead of rider inputs. If I watch the MotoGP events it's usually when I have nothing better to do. And more to confirm what I already expect to see every time. It's very predictable, just like the quality of the majority of posts on Crash - poor.


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