TalentFan

April 11, 2013 7:40 AM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ Lad. "motorcycle dynamics is very much similar to that of aircraft as you again deal with three dimensional orientation and control of bikes. for example, banking angle, Roll, Yaw and acceleration" This I 'get'. However, the effect of suspension movement, chassis flex and forces upon it from grip & power delivery, weight transfer (under accel & braking, as well as rider input) etc. etc. mean that no vehicle behaves quite like a motorcycle. Aero, Bank, Roll & Yaw sure, but doing it on the ground using mechanical grip is different to aircraft in the air, yes? IMO a bike has different challenges to anything else, & a MotoGP is the extreme example of this, where the smallest step can mean win or lose.

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 7:59 PM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ Realist I wasn't making it 'about' Rossi. I happen to think VR had a storming ride on Sunday. I have no beef with Rossi, & have said so many times. I do have issues with many of his fans, who unfortunately tend to gush with praise for VR, and get the knives out for anyone else. Why I don't understand, & its totally unnecessary, but its more prevalent by far than with fans of any other rider it seems. Is 'Lad' a VR fan? For sure. Yet despite his Msc & brains, he gets his jollies poking holes in CC's efforts, without giving the guy any credit for a decent ride on 2nd string kit. I've never made claim that CC is as good as the guys that were Top 4 Sunday, just that he doesn't have an equal opportunity with them to succeed or fail as they do. To say that he does (e.g. Lad & others) is what I've railed against, nothing more.

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 7:42 PM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ Lad "I studied Aeronautical engineering and recently got My Msc in CFD from Southampton university. and my strength is in engineering Dynamics. So yes I know enough to give credible opinion as the bike dynamic is almost identical to aircraft dynamic." Well, I don't have an engineering quali. But I do know that aircraft don't have a single driven rear wheel, that puts maybe 240Hp down through it, so a plane will have NOTHING like the same issues accelerating off a corner (or braking into one) eh? You'll be telling me that boats, escalators & flat-pack furniture have the same 'dynamic' as a MotoGP bike next.

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 4:26 PM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

Thing is - R6Ryder and others pontificating that CC is not good enough might well be right. The odds of making it are much slimmer than not, so they are hardly sticking their necks out are they? But... for them to declare that its 100% CC as they are is nothing more than an OPINION based on small amounts of information & with NO solid evidence. If CC was on truly identical kit - then there's a lot less argument. The fact that there ARE variables in kit / team / budget mean a direct comparison CANNOT be made by any of us. Trolls like to be negative and bash cos its what they do. The guy did really well, but still its uncharitable comments. How many are Rossi fans I wonder (my bet is 'most').

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 4:13 PM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ R6Ryder "the frame is a WORKS Yamaha frame tried and tested to work!" Kenny Roberts Snr used to ride on a WORKS Yamaha frame too. Doesn't mean its as good as the stuff today though does it? T3's frame is 'Works' yes. It's also a couple of generations (as in start of last season's, not end of last season or 2013 version). No doubt its very close and very very good. That doesn't mean AS good. I believe they call this phenomenon 'Development' - which tends to mean 'improved' or why introduce the new stuff and then keep on using it? Why do people insist on using a small part of the whole (of what's available to us outsiders even) data as facts to try to force & 'prove' a flawed conclusion?

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 10:35 AM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

CC needs to be a better starter though. When he headed Dovi, it was shown that he had the speed to pull away. When behind, CC could catch Dovi and not get past him without a proper do-or-die banzai lunge. Cal has work to do for sure. You can bet he knows it too. Can he work on his weak areas? Well, he's shown huge improvement since he got on a MotoGP bike, so it has to be possible that he can. But to try and say he doesn't have a machinery / team / budget disadvantage to overcome as well as 4 seriously good competitors to get on the box is absolute drivel. Lad - if you need educating about acceleration and why top speed isn't EVERYTHING, just part of the answer, check out drag racing. Often the winner will post a lower terminal speed than his rival - he won cos he got to his terminal speed earlier and held it for longer.

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 10:29 AM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ Lad As for the Dovi v CC thing. Dovi did a great job and is vastly experienced. Even so, CC often caught AD running faster and couldn't pass. Dovi is considered 2nd only to DP as the best starter on the grid. He is also considered to be just about THE hardest guy to pass on the brakes - its a very strong area of his game. Note that Hayden said the same after Qatar - he caught AD but could not get by. If you have the same bike, then its next to impossible to get by on the straight. if the guy then brakes SO late you can't get him INTO the corner - then you cant use your corner speed as you are held up by the guy. Cal has a problem passing for sure. But its not all down to CC, but to the characteristics of the bike and of those he's riding against. Just to say he's c*ap like you do is childishly simplistic & unpleasant IMO.

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TalentFan

April 10, 2013 10:20 AM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ Lad - Have you ever ridden a motorcycle on track? Its not JUST about the top speed. Its very much about HOW FAST you GET to the top speed. Its hard to pass the Honda's as they have the best drive out of a turn, and get to their top speed faster and sooner along the straight. So - they pull away from the T3, and are maintaining their top speed for longer before they have to brake. Rossi's factory bike as well. That equals covering ground faster through machinery performance. Rossi rode it well for sure, but.. If someone doesn't understand the fundamentals, then banging on & slagging CC (and flying in the face of what real experts like Neil Spalding & others say) is just going to make you look daft.

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TalentFan

April 09, 2013 4:32 PM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ Codger "Marc pulled the plug on the straight and went past Rossi as though he was on a CRT. Be interesting to hear Rossi's take on that." Best guess? That HRC is a rocket, and is piloted by a Microbe. So - there's a significant advantage with less weight and mass to shove through the air to improve acceleration to top whack. There was also the ability to increase his mass advantage exponentially by slipstreaming - Rossi punches a nice big hole in the air, and the lighter, smaller, faster-accelerating MM could then slingshot by. He did it to Dani too - the passes looked very easy & comfortable from the helicam shot. Interesting thing is that Rookie MM's HRC managed the tyres better than DP's too - luck or a fantastic crew/set-up?

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TalentFan

April 09, 2013 4:24 PM

MOTOGP » Qatar MotoGP: Crutchlow 'frustrating' fifth after factory fight

@ RocketR1 "If Cal was being held up in the Corners by the HRC's he should have passed them? Rossi Did.." Well, going on Cal's pre-race comments (which are substantiated by others) it looks like the Yam likes to be slowed down slightly more progressively into the corner, then carry more corner speed to run its best lap-time. Of course, if the bike in front is a) faster, b) more suited to 'stop-turn-FIRE' & slower mid-corner speed (i.e. HRC's) then you can't close enough to get by before the corner, and can't outbrake them into the corner, nor have the drive to out-drag them on the exit of the corner. So you're frustrated but stuck behind - Cal's issue IMO. Rossi had more shunt than Cal on the approach to the corner - he blew by Cal, and also Dani on the straight. No argument VR rode really great too, but no doubt VR's ability to pass would have been severely compromised if he'd been on Cal's T3. At least, that's what the camera shots of relative pace at key track points suggest

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